Differences Between Mt.24:29-31 and 1 Thess.4:13-17
First of all the verses in Matthew address “time or when,” something happens while the verses in Thessalonians address “who” things happens to.
Mt.24:29 tells us what is going to take place immediately after the tribulation of the Day of the LORD, the day for the vengeance of our God:
- The sun shall be darkened
- The moon shall not give her light
- The stars fall from heaven
- The powers of the heavens shall be shaken (all 3 I suppose)
On the other hand 1 Thess. 4:13-15 tell a different set of events.
- Vs. 13 is speaking about dead Christians who are asleep
- Vs. 14 tells us that those who are asleep “in Jesus” will God bring with him (bring where, when)
- Vs. 15 tells us that we who are alive and remain shall not precede those who are dead.
In Mt. 24:30 3 things happen:
- Then (after there is no light on the earth because the sun and moon aren’t shining and stars have all disappeared), a sign of the son of man appears in heaven.
- Then shall all the nations of earth mourn, (beat and strike their breasts in grief or lament)
- And they shall see the son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory
Now in 1 Thess.4:16 we see 2 things:
- Jesus himself descends from heaven with a stimulating cry of incitement, with the voice or tone of the archangel Michael, that reverberates like God!
- Next we see the dead in Christ rising up from the dead, first.
Back in Mt. 24:31 we see 1 maybe 2 things happen;
- He, Jesus, shall send his angels with great reverberation and
- They shall gather together his elect from the 4 quarters of heaven, not earth, from one extremity to the other. Who are these elect? I don’t know specifically, but I do know they weren’t Christians, because Jesus nor any other Hebrew Prophets knew there would be a group called such. These elect, because they are gathered from the 4 quarters of heaven, could be angels, since they are the only other ones in heaven, besides God and Jesus. 1 Tim. 5:21 calls the angels elect. Maybe they are Israelites. One thing we do know, they aren’t Christians.
For our final verse of 1 Thess. 4:17 we have 3 things happen:
- Then we who are alive and remain (on the earth) shall be caught up, snatched, together with them (the dead in Jesus) in the clouds.
- To meet the Lord in the air
- So shall we ever be with the Lord (we go wherever he goes).
SUMMARY
- WE CAN CLEARLY SEE THAT THE 2ND COMING JESUS SPOKE ABOUT WILL BE AFTER THE TRIBULATION, THE DAYS OF GOD’S WRATH.
- WE KNOW THAT CHRISTIANS ARE LITERALLY RESCUED FROM GOD’S WRATH ACCORDING TO 1 THESS. 1:10, 5:9; THEREFORE THE RAPTURE IS BEFORE THE TRIBULATION.
- NOTHING HAPPENS TO THE SUN, MOON AND STARS AT THE RAPTURE
- NO SIGN OF THE SON OF MAN APPEARS BEFORE JESUS DESCENDS FROM THE CLOUDS TO MEET US IN THE AIR.
- JESUS DOESN’T SEND HIS ANGELS TO GATHER US TOGETHER FROM HEAVEN, THE LORD HIMSELF MEETS US.
- THERE IS NO ONE BEATING THEIR BREASTS IN GRIEF OR DREAD AT HIS APPEARANCE
- NO ONE ON THE EARTH SEES HIM DESCENDING AT THE RAPTURE
- THERE IS NO MENTION OF ANY DEAD BEING GATHERED TOGETHER AT THE 2ND COMING
- THE ONLY ONES I CAN SEE BEING GATHERED TOGETHER AT THE 2ND COMING ARE ANGELS PREPARING FOR THE BATTLE OF HAR-MO’ED, TO QUASH THE BEAST AND THE FALSE PROPHET AND THEIR ENTOURAGE.
- NO ONE, LIVING OR DEAD, IS BEING RAISED FROM THE EARTH MEETING JESUS IN THE AIR AT THE 21ND COMING.
- THERE CAN BE NO DOUBT THAT THESE ARE 2 SEPARATE EVENTS WITH HARDLY ANYTHING IN COMMON
Post Script
Concerning the supposed trumpet(s), Mt. 24:31 says And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect KJV
“Sound” is not in the texts; neither is “a.” Trumpet is translated from NT:4536 salpigx (sal’-pinx); perhaps from NT:4535 (through the idea of quavering or reverberation): 4535 is salos, a vibration, a billow.
(Biblesoft’s New Exhaustive Strong’s Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)
Think of Jimi Hendrix playing the guitar to picture a great reverberation! IMO, trumpet is a supplied analogy. Could just as easily been a bugle, but I don’t think it was either.
The etymology of the ancient Greek word salpinx (σάλπιγξ) is somewhat obscure but is widely believed to be onomatopoeic or descriptive of its sound. onomatopoeic: ɒnəmatəˈpiːɪk/adjective
- (of words) formed in imitation of a natural sound “it was independently developed in more than one place as an onomatopoetic term”
- of or relating to or characterized by onomatopoeia. Onomatopoeia is a type of word, or the process of creating a word, that phonetically imitates, resembles, or suggests a sound that it refers to.
Primary Theories of Origin
- “Thunderer”: Many scholars and historical sources suggest the word implies “thunderer” or is linked to the sound of thunder. This connects the instrument’s piercing, loud blast to the roar of Zeus or natural storms, reflecting its use to instill awe or terror in battle.
In 1 Thess. 4:16 it was Jesus himself, not his angels, with a very descriptive battle or victory cry that raised the dead in Christ:1 Thess 4:16
16 for the Lord himself, with an assembling shout, with archangel’s voice and with trump of God, shall descend from heaven; and the dead in Christ shall rise first;
Darby
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Fallen Angels
Most of us have heard about “fallen angels” even though the Bible does not literally support it. If you research “fallen” you will only find one reference to an angel in Is.14:12, which is a prophecy of something to come. This scripture refers the “the Shining One, the Morning Star.”
Isa 14:12
“How you have fallen from heaven,
O star of the morning, son of the dawn! NASU
(The KJV adds the name Lucifer, but there is no such name in the most correct manuscripts).
The reason this verse is still future is because Rev. 12:9 is still future.
9 And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.
NASU
“The fallen angels” refers to those mentioned in Jude 6 and 2Pe.2:4.
Jude 6
And angels–those who did not keep the position originally assigned to them, but deserted their own proper abode–He reserves in everlasting bonds, in darkness, in preparation for the judgement of the great day. Weymouth. This seems to be a free will decision to abandon (desert) their own dwelling place and because they did,
2 Peter 2:4
For God did not spare angels when they had sinned, but hurling them down to Tartarus consigned them to caves of darkness, keeping them in readiness for judgement. Weymouth
Because of their own actions, God cast them out of Heaven; they didn’t fall, they were thrown out!
What sin did they did commit to cause this? For those who may not know we can find that answer in Genesis.
Gen 6:1-4
Now it came about, when men began to multiply on the face of the land, and daughters were born to them, 2 that the sons of God (angels) saw that the daughters of men were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves, whomever they chose. 3 Then the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, because he also is flesh; nevertheless his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.” 4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men, and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown. NASU
Gen 6:4
4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days and also later. That was when the sons of God had sexual relations with the daughters of human beings. These women gave birth to children, who became famous and were the mighty warriors of long ago. NCV
The offspring of these angels were/are the Nephilim. Goliath was a Nephilim, a member of a super race of people, continually evil, mighty warriors and famous men of renown. Nimrod was another. This is the sin that these particular angels committed. They have been in Tartarus ever since the Flood.
Part 2 of The Last Days from 2nd Peter 3
As you will soon see Peter is no longer quoting Joel in 2 Pe 3:3, but he does tie “The Last Days” to “the day of the LORD.” If you have read my book or some of my blog posts you know that the day of the LORD is Yahweh’s day, not the day of Christ or the day of the Lord Jesus. In Joel as well as the rest of the Old Testament through Malachi, when God, who is The Holy Spirit, wanted YHWH mentioned the word LORD in all capital letters was used.
Unfortunately when the New Testament translators referred to the day of the LORD they did not put the word in all caps, but as Lord, which has caused much confusion. All one really has to do is look back and see what a time calamity the day of the LORD is when the day of the Lord Jesus is a time of rejoicing.
2 Pe 3:10 says But, the day of the LORD will come like a thief, and then (sometime later) the heavens will pass away with a loud noise and the elements will be dissolved with fire and the earth and everything that is done on it will be burned up…..waiting for and earnestly desiring the coming of the day of God.
Old Testament prophets didn’t know anything about The Gathering Together, the episunagoge, of the church of God. They didn’t know there would be a Church of God, or that salvation would be available by undeserved divine favor, because God kept it secret from them. If He had not kept it secret from them, the devil would never have allowed Jesus Christ to be crucified and die! (See 1 Cor 2:8).
2nd Thessalonians 2 tells us implicitly in verses 2-3 that the day of the LORD will not come unless the departure, the apostasia, comes first. “And then (and not until then) will the lawless one be revealed!” The revealing, apokalupto, the unveiling of the False Prophet, an Antichrist, marks the beginning of the Great Tribulation and the day(s) of the LORD. The Departure, the Gathering Together, marks the end of salvation by grace.
No one knows when the last days will be or the end times, but we should all live like they are here now since none of us are promised tomorrow. When I say we should live like these are our last days I mean operating the ministry of reconciliation like there was no tomorrow. We are our friends’ and acquaintances’ last best chance to believe in Christ as their Savior. Romans 10:9 and 10 is the number one best scripture for persuading someone to be saved and how to be saved. Let us not be weary in well doing.
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